“a couple of traffic tickets and no criminal history”

I’m a little late on this one, it slipped by me until today.

Jose Guerena, former marine, gunned down in a SWAT raid. Served two tours in Iraq. The SWAT team claims they did not do a no knock warrant, and came in with sirens. (I’d really like to hear from neighbors if that was true.)

How often are we going to tolerate these style SWAT raids? Granted, it’s possible Jose Guerena was involved in some illicit activity. Wouldn’t be the first soldier to do so. But the officers involved have released no details as to any evidence collected.

But even if they did, can we believe them? SWAT teams are becoming quite famed for fabricating lies and planting evidence. (See Kathryn Johnston)

Well it didn’t take long for them to being fabricating. Apparently, they initially claimed Jose Guerena shot first. “They now acknowledge that not only did he not fire, the safety on his gun was still activated when he was killed”

“We spoke with several of the neighbors,” Epps says. “And none of them — none of them — heard any sirens that morning. Every one of them told us they didn’t hear anything, no knocking, no shouting, until the shooting started. They didn’t hear anything until the shooting started.”

Now mind you…it is possible that Guerena was in fact involved in some illicit behavior. Let’s say that all the known evidence to the contrary doesn’t exist and he was. We are seeing a practice of bad habits arising. No knock SWAT raids. Shoot first, question later. And poor intelligence (ie: woman and children in location at time of raid). None of these occurences should be happening in America.

But based on the fact so far, it’s looking pretty damning to police. For those wondering why Guerena would respond with a rifle. Could it be because his wife lost two relatives to a home invasion the year before?

In conclusion, we already know how this will end. It will be sent to an independent police board of made up of knowledgeful examiners. They will review the case in detail and conclude that no wrong-doing was done on the part of the law enforcement officers.

While the rest of us will exlaim, there is a dead “daddy”, a dead “marine”, a dead “American”. Only a liar or a thug can conclude there was no wrong-doing.

If we can sentence Ramos and Compean to prison for 10 yrs for shooting a drug dealer in the butt. How many years should a police officer get for shooting an innocent American who risked his life serving his country in Iraq?

For those who want to have their stomach sickened further, here are some additional links.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/05/25/jose-guerena-arizona-_n_867020.html

http://azstarnet.com/news/local/crime/article_a978c23a-a40f-5d0a-a203-76b88ac67e86.html

http://azstarnet.com/news/local/crime/article_d7d979d4-f4fb-5603-af76-0bef206f8301.html

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5BJ_Jn9rlVs

http://pimasheriff.org/files/1013/0463/5381/OIS050511.pdf

UPDATE: Camera video is posted over at

http://cursesfoiledagain2.wordpress.com/2011/05/27/more-on-the-killing-of-jose-guerena/

Well, it does seem they did have the sirens on for a few seconds. Though that siren sounded a lot more like a car alarm going off than a normal police siren. Wasn’t much of a knock. And far from the original comment that they knocked loudly for

I could almost hear something in the background there. Not sure if it was an officer or Guerena.

Here is what I believe happened. I believe the SWAT team figured they’d roll in like a piece of cake. They’d briefly turn on the siren, knock softly a few taps in order to claim they’d done what they should. Then just knock the door in and tell everyone to go prone.

Instead, they knock open the door and see their suspect armed. They simply opened fire without any hesitation. I understand that the SWAT team wants to go home at night. But police have to take the high road.

Their tactics seem pretty dumb as well. 5 team members at the door. What if there were other aggressors, they’d simply exit the back. Or even come around and flank the officers. Even if Guerena was everything the SWAT team says. This was pretty much a botched raid.

Advertisements

The URI to TrackBack this entry is: https://nugun.wordpress.com/2011/05/26/a-couple-of-traffic-tickets-and-no-criminal-history/trackback/

RSS feed for comments on this post.

8 CommentsLeave a comment

  1. […] the former Marine killed in his home by a SWAT team? Courtesy of N.U.G.U.N., we have a few more details from The Huffington Post. There are a couple of interesting […]

  2. There’s a helmet-cam video of the raid (supposedly) that’s been released. It looks like they did actually run a siren and were calling “police” over a loudspeaker shortly before they broke down the door.

  3. Based on the video, it appears that this was definitely NOT a no-knock warrant and the helmet cam was from someone sitting inside a vehicle. Even from inside the vehicle, I can hear officers at the front door yelling “Sheriff’s Department” and “Search Warrant”.

    Frankly, it looks like the HuffPo is (again) getting a little loose with facts.

    It seems like a lot of people are wanting to bury these cops based on speculation. But the video sure does lend credibility to the SWAT cops version of events.

    Your speculation about the tactics is a little odd. Why do you think that because there were officers at the front door that a perimeter was not set?

    I think there are a lot of people that were hoping this was going to be a “poster child” case for why cops should not serve warrants. Instead, it appears that this was a daytime search warrant, where the officers clearly announced who they were and why they were there.

    Everyone is making a big deal about the decedent being a Marine. How many of the police officers there were also veterans?

    • @Richard – You make some valid points.

      “Your speculation about the tactics is a little odd. Why do you think that because there were officers at the front door that a perimeter was not set?”

      I recall reading that their were 5-6 officers involved. If so, most seemed to be at the door. Though that may be an incorrect statement. That said, it did not seem like they were covering the windows or other areas from the video.

      Furthermore, if it is indeed true that one of the officers had a negligent discharge which, that would also constitute a botch in my book.

      You’re probably right that a lot of people might be making this into a poster child. But a large part of that is because of how many incidents have been occurring, and the behaviors of the police involved. Habit of planting evidence and saying just about anything to cover their butts. (See Kathryn Johnson).

      So is it any real wonder that we no longer give the police the benefit of doubt?

      Of about 10 experiences I have had with law enforcement officers, 2-3 of them have been positive and professional. The others have been embarrassments, and unprofessional.

      It’s sad, because I grew up with a ton of respect for law enforcement. I am an Eagle Scout, I grew up respecting civic servants. But the truth is, a good deal of the behavior of police officers I have witnessed has been unprofessional. I am against the militarization of our police, SWAT teams are becoming more and more common. How many times are these incidents going to happen. Usually it’s just innocent dogs being shot, mayor’s being laid prone, and innocent people too.

      To those cops that take the high road. That serve, and risk their life daily, but still maintain their decency. I wish we could pay you 10x what we do. Honestly, I think we need to do something about how these procedures work. Police are put in many impossible situations. And they’re put in a position where they can admit any mistake – even though mistakes are part of being human. But dealing dishonestly with the public is not the right way. It leads to all else being suspect.

  4. But a large part of that is because of how many incidents have been occurring, and the behaviors of the police involved.
    Also, probably, because of the Sheriff’s constantly changing story. It tends to make it look like there’s something fishy going on.

  5. When the cops announce themselves at your door and you grab a gun our decide not to put it down in response them you are indicating ill-intent. A cop would be a moron not to shoot when he has announced himself and enters to find someone armed. He doesn’t need to wait till he is shot at, the imminent threat to himself and the other officers is already there.
    If you see a man walking into Von Maur with an AK47 are you going to wait till he shoots someone our give him the chance to shoot you before you do something? No, because it is obvious from the circumstances that he is armed with ill-intent just the same as the guy who knows the police are coming in and he grabs a gun in response.

  6. When the cops announce themselves at your door and you grab a gun or decide not to put it down in response to them you are indicating ill-intent. A cop would be a moron not to shoot when he has announced himself and enters to find someone armed. He doesn’t need to wait till he is shot at, the imminent threat to himself and the other officers is already there.
    If you see a man walking into Von Maur with an AK47 are you going to wait till he shoots someone or give him the chance to shoot you before you do something? No, because it is obvious from the circumstances that he is armed with ill-intent just the same as the guy who knows the police are coming in and he grabs a gun in response.

  7. Greetings Joseph,

    From my understanding at the time of the post. The cops did not provide much time from the beginning of actions to entering and shooting. Mind you, this was a family that had just lost relatives the prior year to a home raid by criminals. Something increasingly common in the border states. So his response to lay at ready with his AR rifle was an understandable.

    Furthermore, a number of articles at the time stated that the rifle was found with safety on. Which would seem to indicate that he was already disarming & standing down upon hearing that it was police.

    I understand that police are on edge in such situation. But remember, it is the duty and calling of police to be trained for encounters. A citizen should not be shot simply because they were prepared to defend themselves against an unknown threat.

    If officers are so trigger happy that they’re letting off rounds before they even enter the door. Then how is any citizen to have the opportunity to stand down. Or do you advocate a citizen should not endeavor to defend themselves on the off chance that it is an officer knocking down their door.

    A similar incident occured a while back at a Costco. The police did not give the man time to respond. Gave conflicting orders. And chose to simply shoot first ask questions later. Yes, I understand that many officers have families. And they want to go home to them at night. But so do we…

    The difference is, a police officer is supposed to be trained to evaluate a situation before going in guns blazing. And that training seems to be inadequate these days.


Leave a Reply

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in:

WordPress.com Logo

You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Log Out / Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out / Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out / Change )

Google+ photo

You are commenting using your Google+ account. Log Out / Change )

Connecting to %s

%d bloggers like this: